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Yes or No: $700M on St. Louis Rams' Dome Upgrades?

The St. Louis Rams have outlined a renovation plan for the Edward Jones Dome that is estimated to cost $700 million.

The Rams want us to buy them a new house. Just fixing up its current home—the Edward Jones Dome—won't do. Instead, the St. Louis football franchise expects an extreme makeover, to the tune of $700 million, as it is estimated by a company hired by the St. Louis Convention and Visitors Commission (CVC) to analyze the team's counter proposal to a the CVC's own plan to upgrade the Edward Jones Dome with a $124 million facelift.

If someone doesn't cough up the $700 mil to redo the Dome, it is feared the team will take its football and go home to Los Angeles, where it came from before it was the St. Louis franchise.

All of this wrangling was set in motion in 1995 when the team negotiated a 30-year lease with the CVC. It was stipulated that the CVC had to keep the Dome in the "first tier" of NFL stadiums in the league or else it could terminate the lease and would be free to move out of St. Louis.

The current Edward Jones Dome was financed by the City of St. Louis, St. Louis County and the state with $256 million in bonds, a 30-year mortgage that ultimately will see the three entities spend $720 million to pay off.

But whether there will be a team playing in St. Louis by that time is a big question as the Rams' vision of first-tier status appears to be out of the current reach of city, county and state budgets. On KWMU's St. Louis On the Air yesterday, St. Louis Mayor Francis Slay said no, we can't spend any amount of money to retain the team.

The cold reality of the Rams "business" decision to seek a massive renovation to the Dome appears lacking in any civic partnership between the team and the fans that pay to watch its games. The football played in the Dome during the team's 17 years in St. Louis has been alternately great and frustratingly inept. There is a Super Bowl season to savor, and many losing seasons that were endured.

However, does it really matter how well the team plays? Is it important only to have a team?

Today's questions are: How far are taxpayers willing to go to support the Rams? Should the possibility the Rams leaving St. Louis be enough to persuade people to build a new house for the team? In this age of impersonal business dealings, should Rams fans expect any civic loyalty from the team they have supported for 17 years?

Please weigh in with your two cents, or 700 million cents, by commenting below.

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mike k May 17, 2012 at 06:20 pm
very nice, let the Rams go and St. Louis becomes second class to Kansas City
donna May 17, 2012 at 06:25 pm
I don't feel they have earned that monies, any way why not have the people that own them put their monies where they want the dome, the team has been a big disappointment for us,they have not played well since Curt and Dick.
Angela M. DeVito Gahan May 17, 2012 at 06:59 pm
NOWAY That Dome is great!!If The Rams Feel it isn't then maybe they should pay to improve it. They play there!!! The team has the money to do the upgrades. The City of St. Louis got stuck the first time building it and now they want a whole new stadium. Thats crazy. Its like most people are barely affording to get by and The Rams want the people who don't go to see these games because they can't afford them to update it. Why not ask the people who go and pay for those psl's and stuff to update there space. If the Rams want this they should pay for it.
Benjamin Israel May 17, 2012 at 07:14 pm
It seems that people have forgotten that voters passed initiative referendums in both the city and the county that prohibit both entities from giving any public money to a professional sports facility without first having a vote of the people. The city and county approved public funding that went into the newest Busch Stadium just before the two propositions passed. I doubt that voters in either the city and county would approve at a time when basic services are taking a hit. I certainly wouldn't. If the government found an extra $700 million somewhere and gave it to the four campuses of the University of Missouri, it would do a lot more for economic development than a building used ten times a year.
Jim Wells May 17, 2012 at 07:15 pm
If you think this is a "yes" or "no" question, you've confirmed my opinion that
you're a bunch of morons.
Thomas J. Stein May 17, 2012 at 07:19 pm
It's no use. It's completely hopeless for the Rams remaining in St. Louis. There is absolutely nothing ANYONE can do about it. Not even Mayor Francis Slay, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell, or even Missouri Governor Jay Nixon. Not even Missouri Government can do anything to keep the Rams in St. Louis. Just save everybody all of this aggravation and just move the Rams back to Los Angeles. Let's face it. St. Louis wasn't meant to be an NFL city in the first place, and it never will be an NFL city. LET'S GET THE NFL OUT OF ST. LOUIS ONCE AND FOR ALL!!!!! That would make everybody happy.
Michael Rhodes May 17, 2012 at 07:49 pm
Wouldn't make me happy.
Michael Rhodes May 17, 2012 at 07:53 pm
I believe there was an article that they could raise the money by increasing the hotel tax and other methods that would not require a vote of the public.
Not sure how many times the Dome is used per year; it is more than 10 times. I know the Home Show and Auto Show both use the Dome and the Rams play 10 games there each year. I think the NRA also used the Dome when they were here. NCAA tourney games as well.
Don May 17, 2012 at 08:10 pm
The dome can seat 66,965 according to Wikipedia. If each seat paid an extra $65 per game for all 8 home games for the next 20 years, they could raise the $700 million from the devoted fans that use the stadium.
I'm tired of millionaires wanting the taxpayer to cover their expenses. The taste of Bidwell's demands still leaves a bitterness in my mouth. As I was growing up, I often wondered why St Louis couldn't have a good team like the Rams of the 60's. It was like a dream when they moved here. Reality check time now. St Louis is too small a market to keep up with the larger cities in the league. No sense in trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Thanks for the 1999 season, Bye
James Cleeve May 17, 2012 at 08:46 pm
I say NO. Want a better stadium? Be a better team! Win more games! Then let's talk about it. We can't fill the current stadium anymore with their poor performance as it is. The current stadium has nothing to do with team performance...
Michael Rhodes May 18, 2012 at 12:18 am
I doubt that would help much. Look at the Cardinals. They came of a World Series Championship and met lots of resistance to replacing Busch (old) Stadium.
Michael Rhodes May 18, 2012 at 12:36 am
I wish I could say I am suprised by some of the comments here. Maybe the Rams are gone and maybe they aren't. This a process similar to buying a car or house. Each side is going to try and get the better deal. The hope is that they are able to meet somewhere in the middle that makes the best sense for the area and the Rams. This is why the negotiations should have remained closed until an tentative agreement was reached. Then the citizens could review the plan and comment (and vote if needed).
What is the saying: putting the cart before the horse.
Rich Pope May 18, 2012 at 03:26 am
The Rams suck. Let them leave.
Thomas J. Stein May 18, 2012 at 03:29 am
I'm with you on that.
Phil Gonzalez May 18, 2012 at 03:36 am
THE HANNCOCK AMENDMENT to the Missouri Constitution ( a bad constitution, by the way) PROHIBITS TAX INCREASES OR FEES for anything WITHOUT A VOTE OF THE PEOPLE. Do you people know this bit of information?
Michael Rhodes May 18, 2012 at 11:04 am
That amendment prevents an increase in state residents percentage of taxes from income. I do not believe it would cover a hotel tax or tourism tax. The two articles I saw said that there are many loop holes in the amendment. I could be wrong.
Rob Hudson May 20, 2012 at 05:51 pm
Why does any city want a professional football team? They play 8 home games a season. Maybe a couple more if they make the playoffs and have home field advantage. Is the economic benefit really that great?
Michael Rhodes May 20, 2012 at 10:37 pm
Estimated at $20 million per game or $160m each year in revenue. Taxes generated would exceed $20m per year (athletes pay income tax to the city and state when they play a game here). If you have a succesful team (1999 Rams or last years Cards) the amount would go up with post season games.
Rob Hudson May 20, 2012 at 11:07 pm
Interesting. How does that compare to the revenue generated by baseball and hockey? Or basketball, if we had a team?
Scott Simon May 21, 2012 at 08:24 am
We had lower unemployment from 1988-1994 when we didn't have an NFL team. Wait until an agreement is reached? For their benefit at the expense of taxpayers? Gee no wonder they wanted to be confidential!
Vince Burress May 21, 2012 at 10:21 am
I completely agree. Someone ought to forward your statement to the Rams execs.
Michael Rhodes May 21, 2012 at 12:58 pm
Quick Googole search indicates the Cards pay the city about $10m/yr in admission and other taxes. The St. Louis Regional Chamber and Growth Association (RCGA) estimates that the economic impact of the 2012 Cardinals' season on the St. Louis region will be approximately $322 million, with an estimated $160 million this year in direct impact and $162 million in in-direct regional economic activity. There was also information that each WS game last year generated $500k in taxes and $2.6m for each game in revenues.
Michael Rhodes May 21, 2012 at 01:03 pm
No St. Louis basketball team. I did find the Oklahoma City Thunder numbers. It is estimated that they generate $1.3m/game in revenues.
I couldn't find anything on the St. Louis Blues. I would expect thier impact to be much lower than the NFT, MLB, and NBA though.
Michael Rhodes May 21, 2012 at 01:04 pm
Typing troubles this morning. Google and the NFL!
Michael Rhodes May 21, 2012 at 01:19 pm
Scott: We also had a Chyrsler plant and a solid banking industry. Since then we lost the Chrysler plant, had a mortgage crises, and a near crash of the bank industry. Not sure of the relationship between not having and having an NFL team to unemployement level is suppose to prove?
Think of this another way. People are getting worked up over the $700m price tag right now. When (if) it ends up being $300/400m some people may see that as a deal now. Yet, if the process had runs it's course and a tentative agreement reached at $300/400m those same people may have been up in arms over that amount.
Rob Hudson May 21, 2012 at 05:48 pm
Thanks for all that extra info. I can see now the benefit of having and keeping the Rams, as long as there is no, or very minimal, public funding involved. Otherwise the revenue gains can easily be wiped out by the cost of using tax dollars to finance any stadium improvements.
Michael Rhodes May 22, 2012 at 01:01 am
Rob: I agree with you. Any funds should be able to be recouped based on a new lease lenght, In a previous example if the public puts up $200m and the region can gain $20m/year in tax revenue than the lease should be at mimimum 10 years (break even). I would want a 20 year lease myself.
Don May 22, 2012 at 02:06 am
Maybe we can pay for the improvements to the stadium with the taxes generated by Ball Park Village?
Michael Rhodes May 22, 2012 at 11:58 am
Those taxes are already ear marked for the $18m in bonds being sold to develope the site. Which still has not gotten through the planning phase. There is suppose to be a new plan with financing already set by the developer and the Cardinals.
george theodorakos May 24, 2012 at 03:22 pm
let them move to LA...Georgia made a small fortune immediately...about $70 million on PSL's before the first game was even played.....let Kroenke take them back to LA and get the PSL revunue from the good people in LA..plus they can build the dome stadium and the top tier for him.....enough is enough when it comes to professional sports.....i hope they price themselves right out of the market...
Note Article
Just a short thought to get the word out quickly about anything in your neighborhood.
Share something with your neighbors. Write a new post... What's up? Make an announcement, speak your mind, or sell something
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My above comment is applied to Ikea store locations in the St. Louis area
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